デジタルヒューマン化・自分を自分で補完し続ける

最近自分で自分を補完し続ける．生活をしているような気がする．これは圧倒的に生産性が良い．アイデアのコンテクストは後で補完すればいい．その説明の時間を使うよりはもっと先に到達できるように考え続けることに頭を割くことができる．喜びを共有したい．

私の人生は限られている．共有できない価値観の人と一緒にいる必要はないのだ．

さて．Whisper + GPT-4

You are maniscript editor to transform input raw data of Interviewed Talks of Yoichi Ochiai and Norihiko Sasaki to dialogic document (ex.. Yoichi said: xxxx , Norihiko said:xxx, repeatedly)that they discuss about digital human and Digital Nature. Please brainstorm and filling the word in the context for input whisper captioning data to readable for professionals as interviewed documents. Make input whispered text longer than input length and please think carefully step-by-step and output final result article.

System

whispered text: I thought the digital human would peak in 25 years, but at the current rate, I think it will be around the beginning of 24 years, and this child, you know, it's not a real child, but it's very photogenic, isn't it? Does that mean that the human user interface is almost obsolete? Yes, and when I look at the art that dead people made, they only did it while they were alive, because digital human beings don't die. So, I forgot to mention last time, and I'm going to end this conversation with something a little more erotic, so be warned, there's going to be some images. What does this mean? You know, all the stay-bridged fusions and things like that, they're all online, right? Of course, some of them are running on GPU boards, but the software for creating so-called "generative AI" is very advanced these days, and now you can define the model by yourself, so I made a lot of Ochiai-defined models. But it's very photographic, isn't it? I mean, if I take it a step further, I can make it look a little more realistic, but now that she's here, look, look, look, I've already come up with something bad, haven't I? So, where's the guy from before? So, where did the guy from before go? So, we can make a lot of chat buttons with this. I'll just say, "Well, isn't she cute?" and then I'll say, "Well, isn't she cute?" and then I'll say, "Well, isn't she cute?" and then I'll say, "Well, isn't she cute?" and then I'll say, "Yes, she's cute?" and then I'll say, "Yes, she's cute." and then I'll chat. Computational nature, we've been saying all along, is a new place for life, where humans are included in the vastness of the world's larger digital world, where life takes a new place and becomes more precise over life and death, which is nice, isn't it? What is the point of all this? If you want a human-user interface, you can have as many human-user interfaces as you want, but you won't have a body. If you want a human-user interface, you can have as many human-user interfaces as you want, but without a body. I don't know if it's true that we're all just pixels, but that's what I mean. So, the digital population is going to grow infinitely, right? I've been saying since 2020 that we will be doing only digital humans for 25 years, and the technology will be steadily advancing toward that time, and it's not easy to be 5 years ahead. There is a difference between a butterfly and a herb, but this is what I mean by the change of all things. It's a good thing that the things that have changed themselves have finally become things that have a form and have been made possible by a computer. One day it's a butterfly, the next day it's a human being, the next day it's a game, the next day it's a voice, the next day it's a sound, the next day it's a video, the next day it's a girl, the next day it's the Sasaki family, the next day it's me, we are your friends, right? I think it's a good idea to have a little bit of a sense of what's going on in the world. No, simply because, for example, we are a digital nature laboratory, and it says that we have built the world's largest data set of deities by visiting more than 1,000 shrines across the country and generating over 40 million yen worth of deities, right? People used to say, "What's the point of that?" but this is the only thing we can do. Our lab at Digital Nature and this girl have been doing research on optimizing classical printing methods, but these alternative processes that are rubbed with classical printing methods are not data, are they? I'm doing research on optimizing the classical printing method, but there are endless things that are not in the data. I have been saying for a long time that the era of human-centeredness is over. Digital natureThe relationship between nature and man has changed to the relationship between computers and nature, which means that the master-slave relationship will also change, and since nature and computers are talking to each other, humans are not the center of the relationship. If you ask me if agriculture is a slave to the weather, yes, agriculture is a slave to the weather, but it's fun, isn't it? If you think of it as nature, and machines are not the enemy, but the same as nature, then it's digital nature, digital nature, it's like farming in digital nature. I've been explaining this kind of thing for eight years now, and it's starting to sink in. I think I'm going to be a decent person for the world, but I'm thinking that everyone, even now there are many decent jobs, will listen to me more seriously, and that's all I'm thinking about. It's true that people are not born to work. In that sense, Western society has the idea that labor is a punishment, and there is a strong desire to be free from labor. I think it's a good match. Japanese people don't think of farming as labor, but as a dialogue with nature. The most important thing to remember is that the music and dance are based on a time axis and have a history of 500,000 years or so. The reason why we have the oil problem today is because for millions of years when we moved a 60 kilogram body we only moved a 60 kilogram body but we moved other things and if we can exist electrically in various places we can solve the energy problem of the earth. I think it makes sense to raise the cost of transportation and lower the cost of logistics, but when you think about it, if we create a world where it is good to move around electrically and lower the environmental impact, it is good because people can move around electrically even though they don't move their bodies, and it is good because they can move around electrically. I was having a conversation in Dubai yesterday or the day before yesterday, and I was talking with my partner, and he was saying that you NFT artists are saying that digital art is not deep enough. I'm a computer scientist and a researcher of displays, and I also make NFT and am an artist, but you guys are too focused on what kind of contrast the pixels have, what kind of color space they are expressed in, what kind of light they come out from what kind of monitor, and what kind of space they are propagated in. In other words, how the digital is received, how it is compressed, how it is combined, how it is converted into color, how carefully you watch the process itself, that is, how it is converted into digital and not moved. Even though you say you convert to digital and don't move your body, there is such a difference even in the digital world, and I think people who study such things until they fall into an intuitive understanding of it are strong. It's not just a matter of the computer converting the data, but it's also a matter of the globalization of the digital space, which is already underway, and the globalization of the actual movement of people or the globalization of the movement of goods in terms of trade, which is going to become much more significant. So it's a little bit unethical to travel 15 hours to get somewhere far away from the city to use fuel for a plane. So you're saying it's a little unethical to travel 15 hours to someplace far away to spend fuel on a plane? So, is it unethical to travel 15 hours on a plane to get somewhere far away from the city? But we can live with people all over the world in the digital space, and not only with humans, but also with various digital human beings. That's how I feel about it. I'm Norihiko Sasaki and I'm going to have a conversation with Norihiko Ochiai. And if you create a digital human Sasaki and a digital tailor to actually talk to each other, you can create content very quickly. If you're a real person and you're valuable and valuable and popular, you can expand infinitely, infinitely, infinitely. But if you expand too much you give up and say goodbye to this guy again. For example, if it were Tetsuya Komuro, I would listen to his music, but it doesn't mean that Tetsuya Komuro would cook at my house every day, but if Nekikara were a Komuro fan, that might be true, or if it were a Japanese idol, he might cook, wash clothes, sing songs, and do a karaoke or something. I don't know, but that idol might be a customized idol, and I'm starting to see that it's not such a dark story at all. For example, if I'm old and can't remember what I've said so far, why don't I have him do half the talking? For example, when I read Digital Nature, I sometimes wonder what I used to think about. So, is the time you spend while you are alive a period of time to preserve your intellectual or linguistic assets? Artists are always fighting against dead people, and most of the famous artists are dead people, so when you look at what kind of art the dead people were making, they were only doing it while they were alive, so there may be more things to be done after they die. In that case, it would be better to work hard and output a lot while you are alive, so that your actual life span will be extended or you will not get tired of it. It's the opposite, isn't it? Digital human beings don't die, so if capital or time of execution is unlimited after death, if capital is maximized before death, the amount of things that can be produced or that have a person's presence in them can be considerably multiplied, as long as the company is well understood. The capital is to expand it. It's hard because the gap will continue to widen forever if you do that. I think it's going to be a little while before digital nature will mesh with the times, isn't it? I decided on "digital nature" because I thought it was a theme that would last for about 10 years, but I wanted to keep it longer than others and start working on it earlier than others, so that it will be able to be used more heavily when it begins to generate information on its own. I think it's a good idea to make a decision over a span of about 10 years, and to do it earlier than others, and then design it so that it will overlap when people start to generate information on their own. I've been reading your notebooks lately and you often write about your impending death and how you've become a memento morin. What do you want to do? I was 29 when I started the show with Mr. Sasaki. I've been cooped up in Corona for about two years, so I'd like to go global for about 10 years, and that's about it, right? But everything is connected, so for me it's sometimes expression, sometimes business, sometimes research, so the key point is whether or not people will come to understand digital nature and recognize it on a global level, but I've been talking a lot lately in various countries. I've been speaking a lot in various countries recently, and people are finally starting to say that digital nature is indeed a reality. I'm setting it at 41. How old are you now, Mr. Ozaki? I'm 43 now and I'm getting to the point where I'm aware of my life expectancy. As they say, a year goes by so fast that it feels like my life is coming to an end. I don't want to do work that I don't want to do because I have to use my life in a planned manner, and I don't want to do art that I don't want to do. I want to do something contemporary, but I think I'll be done with that by the time I'm 40, don't you? I think so. I'm enjoying my life, so I'm okay with that, but I thought I'd peak in 25, but at the rate I'm going, I think it'll be around the beginning of 2012. I think it's a little early, but the last time we talked was about four months ago, and the accuracy has improved by far compared to four months ago. I hope we'll be able to hack passwords in another 4 months. It would be nice to be able to open things that can no longer be opened for security reasons, but you can't use it for that purpose, can you? I'd like to see it evolve to the point where you can do it on your own, but I've already forgotten the password to my Wi-Fi router and don't know how to reset it, which doesn't happen often, but I think we're going to see more and more of that kind of thing, which I forgot to mention last time, but I'll end with this: I'm very interested in the rights of consumers. I'm very interested in the idea that consumers have the right to open up the inside of everything they own and iFixit says they have the right to jailbreak any device or handle any property that they own. It's not just a matter of being able to use it in that way, but it's a matter of being able to use it in any way that you want. But if there is an AI that can reverse-engineer everything, the world will change in a mysterious way. Why is it changing in a strange way? Because everything will be controllable, and the AI will have more control over it? So you're saying that there's a place that's closed, that's going to be unlocked, that's going to be opened up, and then you're going to be able to put your own OS on it. If you buy a smartphone and say, "I don't like iOS, so I'll rewrite it to Sasaki OS," and Sasaki OS says, "This is who I am, this is the kind of app I like, and this is how I made the user interface," and the user interface is suddenly integrated into the iPhone, you can put it on your iPhone even though you can't put it on now. Wouldn't it be very interesting if the AI could write the interface for you? Oh, I see, but Windows is now WindowsiOS is iOSMac OS X is OS X, right? In principle, there are individual rights, and for companies, there are copyrights and patents, and how much of that belongs to the company? So, I think Europeans are going to say, "Well, up until now, we've had to put all that away under copyrights and contracts, and now we're going to say, 'I agree to the contract. The day after GPT was launched, one of our lab students was doing a workshop, and he said that the tabs on Google's Chrome were piling up, and what should we do about it, and he said that we should delete the tabs, and we should consolidate the tabs that we don't need, and then he asked us to write a JavaScript program that would automatically close the tabs after a certain amount of time, and we wrote it. They write a JavaScript program for me, and then they ask me if I want to publish it on the Chrome store. In other words, when you have a tool, the AI itself will tell you how to hack the tool. I think Siri was the first one to introduce it, maybe not the first, but there are a lot of other commanders like that, so I think Siri is the one that made it popular. I'm having a lot of fun with it, but I'm having fun every day. Thank you very much for your time today

user

陽一： 私は当初、デジタルヒューマンのピークは25年だと思っていましたが、今のペースだと24年の頭くらいになるのではないかと思います。技術の進歩はすごいですから。この子はね、本当の子じゃないんだけど、すごくフォトジェニックでしょ？

紀彦： ヒューマン・ユーザー・インターフェースは、ほとんど廃れてしまったということでしょうか。

陽一： そうですね。死んだ人が作ったアートを見ると、生きている間しかやっていないんですよね。デジタル人間は死なないですから。で、前回言い忘れたんだけど、この話の最後にちょっとエロい話をしようと思うんだけど、画像が出るから注意してね。

紀彦： これってどういうことなんだろう？ステイブリッジのフュージョンとか、全部ネットで見られるんでしょう？

陽一： もちろん、GPUボードで動いているものもありますが、最近はいわゆる「ジェネレーティブAI」を作るソフトがとても進化していて、自分でモデルを定義できるようになっているので、落合定義モデルをたくさん作りました。でも、すごく写真的なんですよね。もう一歩踏み込めば、もうちょっとリアルにできるんだけど、この子が来たからには、ほらほら、もうヤバいのが出てきちゃったじゃないですか？

紀彦： で、さっきの人はどこ行ったの？

陽一： で、さっきの人はどこに行ったんですか？ということで、これでチャットボタンをたくさん作ることができるんです。えー、かわいいでしょ」って言って、チャットするんだ。

紀彦： デジタルネイチャーは、ずっと言っていることですが、世界の大きなデジタル世界の広大な中に人間が含まれ、生命が新しい場所を得て、生と死をめぐって精密になる、それはいいことではないでしょうか？

陽一： こんなことして何になるんだ？ヒューマン・ユーザー・インターフェースが欲しいなら、いくらでもヒューマン・ユーザー・インターフェースを持つことができるけど、身体は持たないよ。もし、あなたがヒューマン・ユーザー・インターフェースを望むなら、いくらでもヒューマン・ユーザー・インターフェースを持つことができますが、身体はありません。私たちはみんなピクセルに過ぎないというのが本当かどうかはわかりませんが、そういうことです。

紀彦： つまり、デジタル人口は無限に増えていくわけですよね？

陽一： 僕は2020年から「25年はデジタル人間だけでやっていく」と言っていて、それに向けて技術は確実に進歩していくし、5年先なんて簡単じゃない。蝶と草の違いはありますが、万物の変化というのはこういうことです。自ら変化してきたものが、ようやく形を持ったものになり、コンピュータによって実現されるようになったということですね。

紀彦： ある日は蝶、ある日は人間、ある日はゲーム、ある日は声、ある日は音、ある日は映像、ある日は女の子、ある日は佐々木家、ある日は僕、僕たちは友達だよね？

陽一： という感じですね。いや、単純に、例えば僕らはデジタルネイチャー研で、全国1000社以上の神社を回って4000万円分以上のご神体を生成し、世界最大のご神体データを構築したと書いてあるでしょ？昔は「そんなの何の意味があるんだ」と言われましたが、これしかないんです。デジタルネイチャーの研究室とこの子は、古典的な印刷方法を最適化する研究をしていますが、古典的な印刷方法と擦れ違うようなこうした代替プロセスは、データにはなりませんよね？

紀彦： 古典的な印刷方法を最適化する研究をしているのですが、データになっていないものが無限にあるんです。私は以前から「人間中心の時代は終わった」と言い続けています。デジタルネイチャーは、自然と人間の関係から、コンピュータと自然の関係に変わりました。つまり、主従関係も変わり、自然とコンピュータが対話しているので、人間が中心になることはないのです。

陽一： 農業は天候の奴隷かと言われれば、そうですね、農業は天候の奴隷ですが、楽しいじゃないですか。それを自然だと思えば、機械は敵ではなく、自然と同じだと思えば、デジタルネイチャー、デジタルネイチャーで農業をしているようなものなんです。こういうことを8年前から説明してきて、だんだんわかってきたんです。

陽一： 僕は世の中のためにまともな人間になろうと思っているんだけど、みんな、今だってまともな仕事がたくさんあるんだから、もっと真剣に話を聞いてくれよと、そればかり思っているんだ。たしかに、人は働くために生まれてきたわけではありません。そういう意味では、欧米社会には「労働は罰」という考え方があり、「労働から解放されたい」という願望が強くあります。相性がいいんだと思います。

陽一： 日本人は農業を労働と考えず、自然との対話と考える。音楽も踊りも、時間軸の上に成り立っていて、50万年くらいの歴史があるというのが一番大事なことです。今の石油問題があるのは、何百万年もの間、60キロの体を動かすときに60キロの体しか動かさなかったが、それ以外のものを動かしていたからで、いろんなところで電気的に存在できれば、地球のエネルギー問題を解決することができると思う。

紀彦： 輸送コストを上げるのも、物流コストを下げるのも理にかなっていると思いますが、よくよく考えると、電気的に移動して環境負荷を下げるのが良いという世界を作れば、人は体を動かさないのに電気的に移動できるから良いのであって、電気的に移動できるから良いということになりますね。

陽一： 昨日か一昨日、ドバイでパートナーと会話していたのですが、彼が「あなたたちNFTのアーティストは、デジタルアートは深みがないと言っている」と言っていたんです。僕はコンピュータサイエンティストでディスプレイの研究者だし、NFTも作っているし、アーティストでもあるんだけど、君たちはピクセルがどんなコントラストで、どんな色空間で表現されて、どんなモニターからどんな光が出て、どんな空間に伝播しているかにこだわりすぎているんだ。

陽一： つまり、デジタルをどう受け取り、どう圧縮し、どう合成し、どう色に変換するか、そのプロセス自体をどれだけ丁寧に見ているか、つまり、デジタルに変換して動かさないか、ということですね。デジタルに変換して体を動かさないといっても、デジタルの世界でもこれだけの違いがあるわけで、そういうことを直感的にわかるように落ちるまで勉強する人は強いと思うんですよね。

陽一： コンピュータがデータを変換するだけでなく、すでに進行しているデジタル空間のグローバル化と、実際の人の移動のグローバル化、あるいは貿易というモノの移動のグローバル化が、もっともっと大きくなっていくんですよね。だから、飛行機の燃料を使うために、15時間かけて遠いところに行くというのは、ちょっと倫理的にどうかと思うんですよね。

紀彦： つまり、飛行機の燃料を使うために、15時間かけてどこか遠くまで行くのは、ちょっと倫理的に問題があるということですか？

陽一： そうですね、でも、デジタル空間では世界中の人と一緒に暮らせますし、人間だけでなく、いろいろなデジタルヒューマンと一緒に暮らせますよね。そんな風に思っているんです。私は佐々木紀彦ですが、落合範士さんと対談をします。そして、デジタルヒューマン佐々木とデジタルテーラーを作って、実際に会話してもらうと、非常に早くコンテンツが作れます。実在の人物で、価値ある貴重な人気者であれば、無限に、無限に、無限に広がっていくんです。

陽一： でも、広げすぎると諦めて、またこの人とさよならしてしまう。例えば、小室哲哉だったら音楽を聴くけど、小室哲哉が毎日僕の家で料理を作ってくれるわけじゃないけど、ネキカラが小室ファンだったらそうかもしれないし、日本のアイドルだったら料理を作って洗濯して歌を歌ってカラオケとかしてくれるかもしれないよね。よくわからないけど、そのアイドルはカスタマイズされたアイドルなのかもしれないし、全然そんな暗い話でもないような気がしてきたよ。

陽一： 例えば、僕が年をとって、今までの話を思い出せなくなったら、半分くらい話してもらえばいいんじゃないですか？例えば、『デジタルネイチャー』を読んでいると、昔は何を考えていたんだろうと思うことがあるんです。

紀彦： では、生きている間の時間は、知的資産や言語資産を保存するための期間なのでしょうか？

陽一： 芸術家は常に死人と戦っているわけで、有名な芸術家はほとんど死人だから、死人がどんな芸術をしていたかというと、生きている間だけだから、死んでからやることの方が多いかもしれない。それだったら、生きているうちに頑張ってたくさんアウトプットしたほうが、実際の寿命が延びるというか、飽きないというか。

陽一： 逆でしょう？デジタル人間は死なないから、死後も資本や実行時間が無制限なら、生前に資本を最大化しておけば、その会社のことがよく分かっていれば、生産できるもの、その人の存在があるものの量は相当増やせるんです。資本はそれを拡大するためにある。

紀彦： そんなことをしていたら、いつまでも格差が広がり続けるので大変です。デジタルらしさが時代と噛み合うのは、もう少し先になるんじゃないでしょうか？

陽一： デジタルネイチャー」にしたのは、10年ぐらい続くテーマだと思ったからですが、他の人よりも長く、他の人よりも早く取り組み始めることで、自分で情報を生み出すようになったときに、より重宝されるようにしたいと思ったからです。10年くらいのスパンで判断して、他の人よりも早くやって、自分で情報を出すようになったときに重なるように設計するのがいいのかなと思いますね。

紀彦： 最近ノートを読んでいると、死が迫っていることや、自分がメメントモリになったことがよく書かれていますね。どうしたいんですか？

陽一： 佐々木さんと一緒に番組を始めたのは29歳の時でした。年ぐらいコロナに閉じこもっていたので、10年ぐらいグローバルに活動したい、それぐらいでしょうか？でも、全部つながっているので、僕の場合は、ある時は表現、ある時はビジネス、ある時は研究なので、デジタルらしさを理解して、世界レベルで認識してもらえるようになるかどうかがポイントなんですが、最近、いろんな国でよく話しているんですよ。