Bob & Jo English-Japanese chat : トイレに行きます？？？

BJ_220813_ENG

Mon, 08/15 20mins
Bob
Bob and Joe podcast. Mediocre English Japanese conversations.


Jo
下手っぴ英語日本語クラス、ボブ&ジョーPodcast。


Bob
What's cracking, everyone? On this podcast, we learn Japanese and English from native speakers.


Jo
Wazz up, I’m Jo Tiger. こんにちは、ジョー・大雅です。皆様にとって、僕たちの下手な会話が英語と日本語の学習の助けになれば嬉しいです。


Bob
ボブ・キャットです。よろしくお願いします。


Jo
うん。ということでね。ボブさん、今日はね、トイレに行く、トイレに行きますっていうのを、英語でどういうふうに言えるか、また日本語でどういうふうに言えるのかっていう話をしたいと思うんだけど。


Bob
But in English, we would probably say, I'm going to go to the bathroom, or I'm going to go to the bathroom. But it's a little bit different because, you know, that's me telling you I'm going to do it. But whenever you told me that this was going to be the topic of how we say it in English versus Japanese, it's kind of funny because in my school, like in the class setting, in high school and middle school even, the most natural way for a student to ask the teacher if they can go to the bathroom is, can I go to the bathroom? Which almost every teacher's response is, I don't know. Can you? Do you understand why that's funny? The way the teachers take it is, do you, do I have the ability to actually go to the bathroom? Like, Can I piss? I don't know. Like, can I not do I have the permission? Like, can my body do it? That's why the teachers always say, I don't know. Can you? I hate it.


Jo
なるほど。Can I go to the bathroom っていうと、あの、いくことができるかっていうのは能力の問題になっちゃうから、そういうふうに先生が本当に君行けるかどうかそんなわかんないよみたいに、こう返されてしまうと。


Bob
That is the correct way to say it. But it has a double meening, so the teacher obviously knows what you mean. They say, can you? As sarcasm.


Jo
だから、Can I go to the bathroom っていう言い方自体は全然悪くないと、ただ先生が、両方の意味に取れるから、からかってそう本当そういうの行けるのかみたいに言われることがあるってことね。


Bob
Without fail. Almost every teacher will do it to you because they think they're being funny. Everyone will do it. The name for that kind of response like, can you? Whenever obviously the real meaning is known. We'd say, that's a smart, elic response, which means you're being sarcastic. Or a more harsh way to say it. You could say, there being a smart ass, which I'm a smart ass all the time. It's funny to be one, but it's annoying when someone is doing it to you.


Jo
で、それ以外の言い方ってあるの、日本語の場合はトイレに行くとかって言うんだけど、トイレっていう言い方以外にお手洗い、ていう言い方が結構日本では使われる。


Bob
If you're in a classroom setting, is that how the student would ask the teacher if they could go?


Jo
先生、お手洗いに行ってもいいですか？もしくは、先生トイレに行ってもいいですか？


Bob
Is it okay if I go? I see. Yeah, it is interesting. It's likely be different. This is one of those reasons why people always say, if you're learning a foreign language, don't think in your native language. Because if I was to translate it directly from English, it would be　お手洗いに行くできますか, which a little different. Well, I guess the correct phrase お手洗いに行くいいですか？


Jo
行ってもいいですか。行くといいですかって何か別れちゃってるから、行ってもいいですかは言う。


Bob
I think I understand. So you break it up. What's that? It's the Mo? Is that a particle?


Jo
I don't know. Honestly. まあ、そんなもんだよ。


Bob
That's how it is.


Jo
日本語教師で、すごく詳しい人だったらなんでそこで「も」を使うとか、文法上の説明できるんだろうけど、私はわからない。


Bob
Yeah, I hear that all the time whenever you're explaining particles. Unless they're the basic ones that say time and place. A lot of it's just I don't know why that one's just right that it just feels right.


Jo
そういうことです。それでね、他の言い方っていうのがあるのかなっていうのを聞きたいんだけど、例えば、トイレ、それから、お手洗いっていうのは言うと、それ以外に例えば便所っていう言い方もあるんだけど、「トイレに行く」っていうのと、「便所に行く」っていうのは、ちょっとニュアンスが違って、練習に行くっていうのは、男同士だったらいいんだけどなんかすごい男っぽい言い方って言うか、何か乱暴な言い方なんだよね、会議の場とか、何かオフィシャルな場面で、誰かが「ちょっと便所に行ってきます」って言うと、すごいびっくりされると思う。


Bob
Why is it so different?


Jo
なんでそんなに違うかってわかんないけど、便所っていう言葉自体がすごいね、ダイレクトすぎるっていうか、ちょっと直接的表現すぎて・・・


Bob
It's like the equivalent of saying like instead of I'm going to the bathroom which that would be お手洗いに行く would 便所に行く be the equivalent of saying I'm going to go take a shit right now. Is that kind of like what it is?


Jo
そういうことですね。


Bob
That's good to know. I will say it is kind of funny. I might use it just because I think it would be funny to see the reaction.


Jo
会議中だったら、ちょっと失礼します、でもう通じるんだよねとか、ちょっと席を外します。


Bob
That brings up another question. What's the difference between すみません and 失礼します? Essentially they mean the same thing. But is there a newer wants of when you use one over the other?


Jo
これはね、今回これを説明してると、もう時間がないぐらいすごいなんか複雑な質問だという気配が漂うんだけど


Bob
Is that complicated?


Jo
すごい何かこれは、大変な説明になるぞっていう気配がプンプンするんだけど、大きく言うと、失礼しますはExcuse meって言う感じで、もう1個のすみませんは I'm sorry、とか。だけども、全然そうなるケースが多いということで、必ずしもそういう意味ではない。例えば、友達と会話してて相手が最近その身内の誰かが亡くなったみたいな話をしたときに、英語でよく「I'm sorry」とか言うんだけど、ああいう感覚っていうのは、何か日本人にするとちょっとわからないっていうか、あの感覚って何なんだろうみたいなところあるんだよね。


Bob
I see. It is kind of interesting that situation you bring up, because this one is more of a joke. But imagine that same situation, and this is in English, where you're visiting someone who lost someone very important to them, that they died. In English. You could say I'm sorry. And it's like a way to console them. But if you say I apologize, which technically means the same thing, what that implies is you were the one that killed them.


Jo
まあ、そうなるよね。


Bob
So if you go to a funeral, do not say I apologize. Say I'm sorry. Don't say I apologize.


Jo
本当そういう意味になっちゃうよね。で、ちょっと話戻すんだけど、そういう何かちょっと席を失礼しますとか、ちょっと席外しますみたいなっていうのはあるのかな。


発言者 1
In place of saying, Can I go to the bathroom? Or I'm going to the bathroom. You can say, Excuse me and then just get up and leave. And then it's kind of implied what you're doing, but doing that the context of the relationship kind of matters.


Bob
For example, a student couldn't just say excuse me and get up and leave because obviously it's the teachers kind of authority to allow that or not. But if you're in, like a business meeting where people are on equal footing, then yes, you could just say, Excuse me and get up and leave. You know, it depends on the relationship a little bit for that one.


Jo
そうだね、日本でも急に生徒が先生に、先生ちょっと失礼しますって言うとちょっとなんか大人びすぎててなんか怖いよね。わかるんだけど、ちょっと怖いよね。


Bob
怖い？なんで？


Jo
急にどうしたどうしたって、いや、なんで怖いかっていうと、ちょっと大人びすぎてるっていうか、大人すぎるっていうか、そういう意味で怖い。あんまりそう言わない気がする。


Bob
That's what the bad guy like. The tough guy says whenever he's about to leave. He doesn't say. Can I go? He just says, 失礼します and walks out the door and puts the sunglasses on. The explosion happens behind them and, like, across the screen just says, Cool guy. You got the image right?


Jo
わかるわかる。そうだね、すごいクールなタフガイのイメージはあるよね。うん。もう1個質問があるんだけど、トイレとか、便所っていう言葉の中に、WCってよく日本はね、トイレの所に書いてて、そのWCっていうのを使った表現っていうのは何か、英語にあるのか。そもそもそのWCっていう風にトイレのことを言うのかっていうのをちょっと知りたいんだけど。


Bob
Now I know why it's called WC. But this is one of those situations where Japanese has, like, old English that no one uses. Maybe British people, use this. But one way you can refer to the toilet or the bathroom, you can call it the water closet, WC. So I think that's where WC came from. Granted, no one like it's very rare for anybody here in America to call it a water closet. Maybe in Britain and England they do, but even then, I don't think so. I think it's a very old way of referring to it. So it's interesting to hear that you call it the WC. Just seems odd.


Jo
なるほどね。WCっていうのは、ウォータークローゼットから来てるんだけど、古い表現で特にアメリカではもう使わない、あのイギリスではどうなってるかわかんないけどっていうことだね。じゃぁ、ちょっと席を立つとか、ちょっと失礼、ちょっと失礼しますと言って言えるってことだったんだけども、ちょっと席を外しますみたいな言い方ってあるのかな。


Bob
I would say in that situation, in English, you could say, Excuse me, I'll be right back, or something of that nature, depending on what you're leaving. For example, if you have a phone call, I mean, you can just get up and point at the phone if there's a meeting going on, and people will know what you mean and then just go out and take the phone call.


Jo
まあ、電話とか手に持ってて、I'll be right back っていうと、すごいわかるんだよね、なんかその場はすぐ戻りますみたいに言ったら電話しに行ったんだなってわかるんだけども、その、何も持たずに、そう言っても通じるのかな。


Bob
Sometimes. In that situation, it's not very clear what you're doing. Like, most people won't confront you. They won't ask you, what are you doing? Where are you going? Most people are, okay, he'll be right back, and they won't think about it. Some people might. Granted, I do think it would be funny if you were in a business meeting and you just stand up real quick and you just say, I'll be back, and then just leave. I've never seen that happen before in real life. But, you know, there's always a day to see it happen. Shoot, I might do it tomorrow. I don't know.


Jo
Yeah, maybe in Terminator 5.


Bob
Yes. And then at the end of the meeting, I'll just say, Hasta la vista, baby.


Jo
いいね。Excuse me? Hasta la vista,Hasta la vista, baby. 最後に、ちょっとまとめようかな。


Bob
When you're going to the bathroom, you can say, Can I go to the bathroom? If you're talking to a superior or if it's between people of equal status, you can just say, excuse me, I'm going to go to the bathroom. Or I'm going to the bathroom. Or in some circumstances, you can just stand up and say, I'll be right back. Or just, Excuse me. Those situations are a little bit more nuanced, though.


Jo
You forgot one thing.


Bob
What's that?


Jo
I'm going to take a shit.


Bob
Oh, yes. And then if you just want to be rash, you could say, I'm going to take shit. Or you could say, I'm going to the shitter. Which honestly might be a better translation. Shitter in English, I guess, would be the best way to put it, because that's one way you can refer to the toilet. That sounds very, like, rough. You can just call it the shitter. Some people call it the Gents, too.


Jo
Gents も言うんだ。


Bob
Yes. Like a name. Like the name of a guy (John). I'm going to the gents. Why? I don't know. Or you can say, I'm going to the Oval Office. Sorry? The Oval Office. That's the name of the President of the United States office. So you can say, I'm going to the Oval Office real quick. Or the Super Bowl. You say? I'm going to the Super Bowl real quick. I'm going to take the Browns to the Super Bowl. What? That one is: There's a football team here, like an American football called the Browns, and you play in the Super Bowl. So whenever you say, I'm taking the Browns to the Super Bowl, it's meaning you got shit, it in the toilet. But it also is like, I'm taking the team, I'm going to make the team win in the Super Bowl. I love that saying.


Jo
それと、 I'm going to go to the gents, とも言える。 Go to the John quick.


Bob
I think so. Granted, here, no one ever really uses that.


Jo
えーと、日本語だと、トイレに行く、席を外す、失礼します。便所に行く。ちょとお手洗いに行ってきます、とかそんな感じかな。もっともっとたくさん言い方はあるんだけども、話が長くなるので今日はこの辺でいいかなと思います。Thank you for listening to our podcast. See you next time.


Bob
Yes, I hope it was useful and I really hope it's fun to listen to. I know it was fun to make this time. I had a fun time. Alright everybody, take care and be careful. みなさん、ありがとうございます。


Jo
ということで、最後までお聞きくださりありがとうございました。また次回、お会いしましょう。


Bob
またね。See you next time!